WriterCon: *fail edition
Aug. 3rd, 2009 12:13 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rmWriterCon has two types of programming: programming that is planned and panelists chosen by Con Programming, and programming organized by attendees and included on the official con schedule but not really endorsed or not by WriterCon. This, as you might imagine, can make things a little murky. I do like that both types of programming exist at the con, but I thought it needed more clarification in places. I explain this because it's necessary to some of the *fail issues I'm about to address.
I also want to note, in what I will go into in a separate post, that there were many, many things I loved about this con: including the focus on transformative works craft, the multi-fandom attendees and the really fantastic efforts of accommodation the Con Staff made towards folks with special needs, including dietary. I have never, ever felt like a con staff cared more about each of its attendees on an individual basis.
Which is why when fail came, I was like "woah, what the fuck?!"
Sadly, I think much of the fail is a product of the fact that people have become defensive. People are scared of these discussions, and I have to say while they are often unfun and heartbreaking (who wants to be the target of this stuff? who wants to realize they've hurt people or a community they care about no matter how inadvertently?) -- jeez they are not going to kill you, and they certainly aren't a reason to fail more.
Like most SF/F and fandom cons, only about 5% of the attendees were PoC. Honestly, this was more than I was expecting, and it was nice to see that these people were part of programming and not just on RaceFail-related topics. Also a plus -- lots of fliers for the Carl Brandon Society.
However, at more than one panel more than one person noticed folks avoiding calling on PoC attendees and had to step in and make sure those people got heard. FUCKED UP.
Of the official programming there was a single panel entitled "Evil in Our Midst: Dealing with racism, sexism and homophobia in fandom." Because of my flight schedule, I was only able to attend half of it. I have to assume it was placed towards the end of the con so that if it went badly, it wouldn't affect the mood of the whole con, but these issues can't be afterthoughts, and scheduling things in such a way to make sure the issue isn't infused throughout the con and prevents people from attending is really problematic. On the plus side, the attendance was pretty damn good anyway!
The panel was made up of a fantastically diverse group and was so able to encompass a lot of perspectives. However, the panel was moderated by a straight, white woman, and I couldn't figure that out. Did the PoC and queer folks need translation? Could they not speak for themselves? This was uncomfortable to me at the time, and has become increasingly more upsetting to me in my head (yes, there's the sexism angle, but because the con was more than 95% female, a white, straight woman in this case is totally a part of the dominant group and appointing her to the position of power was sort of creepy - no slight on her (ETA: who has subsequently posted some great stuff, linked to later in all this, about privilege -- so I get why she was chosen, but the impression is delivered sadly doesn't stop being problematic and I have to believe that other people on the panel would have been equally capable of moderating), I'm just not sure this was thought out super-well.
The panel was necessarily very 101-level although some really interesting stuff came up, including a discussion of Bollywood as a fandom (what does it mean when we fan an entire culture? are you wearing a saree because you like the aesthetic or because you're cosplaying? do you get how that impacts actual South Asian people?) and the usual vaguely derail-y things ("should our goal be not to offend anyone?").
Then I had to leave to catch my flight.
And then apparently other things happened that people who were there and people who were on the panel will address at more length and more accurately than me, but the phone call I got at the airport included the report that someone got up and said they felt marginalized for being straight and that they felt marginalized for being in a fandom and having a child, and I can't not address this. (ETA: I have subsequently learned that in small post-panel discussions the woman's point was actually about age-ism in fandom, which is a very real and legitimate problem, but hopefully those discussions also highlighted how incredibly fail-y and rude it was to say "am I not fucked up enough to be in fandom?" -- I'm not fucked up for being queer and my friends aren't fucked up for being transfolk or PoC: further insight into events here: http://community.livejournal.com/writercon/228157.html / http://rahirah.livejournal.com/411832.html (same post, different comments)).
I am queer every day. And every once in a while I get to hang out in a queer space, such that I don't have to worry if I'm dressing femininely enough to get through airport security or if kissing my girlfriend on my street corner at 11:30 at night is really the best fucking idea in the world.
And I get that feeling marginalized even for a minute is weird and can be heartrending. I get this specifically as it applies to fandom: a lot of us were outcasts growing up, a lot of us don't have face-to-face fannish communities to be a part of where we live, and when we go to a con, we want everyone to be just like us. We don't want to be outcasts -- not still, not again.
But I gotta tell you something -- and this isn't about bias and oppression and marginalization, it's just about life -- it's what I learned from fencing, from learning to fight: We all die alone. And we all fight alone. And we all live alone. On some level, we are always, always, always in a space where no one can know what we are feeling and how strange and terrible and lonely we are -- whether we're straight white guys or people of color or queer folks or a mom at a con.
And in being who I am -- someone who is melancholy and mournful, who views the solid presence of other people in my life as a one-in-a-billion craps shoot I can't believe I won -- you have all my compassion, all my love, all my sympathy and all my interest, because that is, innately, how I react to people who, like me, who know this nature of aloneness. You are beautiful to me.
But you need to step back. Because no, you are not marginalized or oppressed because you are part of the dominant group and people who are part of other groups are stepping up to say that we want some damn consideration. Nor are you marginalized or oppressed because you chose to have a kid. I spent most of the weekend with a woman who is second-generation fen and her baby; we wrote fic together, talked about slash and hung out with her wife. So no matter how different you may feel from what you perceive to be the majority of fandom, no one is being oppressed because they have a kid -- if someone's rude to you, that's actually something else -- the -ism's are something way beyond rudeness or you feeling awkward or out of place.
Look, I don't like being part of a marginalized group. It's not fun or romantic. Some of us -- both in these groups and outside of them -- have to learn this, just as many of us have to go through the thing where we learn there's nothing cool or fun about poverty or having to whore (as opposed to choosing to engage in sex work) to put food on the table or get the damn rent paid.
And that's about all I'm capable of saying without resorting to a great deal of obscenity, so I'm going to stop there on this particular part of the situation.
Moving on, I think no one is well-served by there just being one panel for the racism, homophobia and sexism conversations, as they are three very different things. Because transformative works fanishness is perceived as so female dominated (and probably is) the sexism discussion must largely be about internalized-sexism and that's a profoundly different conversation than the conversation about queer fetishization. And race issues are very different from that -- because I can look gender-conforming and straight going through airport security, while PoC don't suddenly get to be white when shopping, going through airport security or taking flack from asshole cosplayers who don't understand the idea of color-blind casting.
People who are family to me in the immediate sense (good friends and creative partners) and in the distant sense (fellow fen) are in pain over what happened, and so am I. It's upsetting, and as one of the panelists kept saying, we need to learn to listen harder and fail better.
The other case of (specific as opposed to atmospheric) *fail happened in a fan-led discussion that was about addressing slash how and whether it should take into consideration real, actual queer people. This panel also had much positive discussion, some of which started to get past a 101-level I thought, but the moderator had a clear agenda that, to me, felt like "those damn gays are meddling in our porn."
The discussion included a hand-out of potential discussion questions, many of which I found mind-blowingly offensive (I've made a deal with at least one other attendee that we're going to post them all with our answers on LJ over the next week or so), and the woman hosting the panel repeatedly snarked on our table (we were not the only queer people speaking up, but we could, rather legitimately, be perceived as a unified force, as it were) for being articulate and was particularly dismissive to the two PoC people at our table (and the combination of "articulate" and PoC is one of those very loaded, sneaky RaceFail things that happen sometimes and that was seriously, seriously sketchy).
I was shocked and appalled, and while some of this woman's viewpoint would have been potentially useful on a panel, to be an individual with an agenda on a sensitive issue with unvetted programming?!?!?! -- WOW. Not Okay.
Also, bisexuality is real. People not getting this came up all over the place -- in slash convos, in convos about internalized-sexism, in people chatting about Torchwood.
Finally, I want to return to the theme of defensiveness. We're now in a phase of this process, of talking about "the evil in our midst," wherein too many people are either bracing themselves for a fight because of the backlash the people speaking out are getting (I think of my table at the above-mentioned queer panel) -- which of course isn't necessarily constructive but something I think we have an unfortunate right to, or looking for a fight, because suddenly (like the straight person who said they felt marginalized in the first panel I talked about) they aren't part of the dominant group all the damn time.
Additionally, people need to stop dismissing conversations about these issues as wank. Wank is when we gossip about people's egos or get into flame wars about how someone behaved at a con or deal with things that make no sense to most of us: like Snape's Wives. Dealing with racism, sexism and homophobia = not wank.
So what good came out of all of this for me personally:
- I have even more love and respect for my friends, especially having watched ones who don't want to have to be the educators on these issues do it anyway.
- I met some really cool new people.
- I did see people have ah-hah! moments.
- I did learn that there are actually large swathes of fandom that missed the RaceFail thing entirely, and so were just sort of getting caught up on how big the problems are.
- I did see the larger community of the con close ranks against fail when it happened.
- I feel more confident in the value of my being willing to talk about this stuff. I don't like falling on this grenade over and over again, but since no one expects me to be "nice" or "non-threatening" or "look the other way" I have more latitude to say what needs to be said.
- I have new frameworks for the discussion.
- Hey, the Carl Brandon society totally deserves my money.
I also want to note, in what I will go into in a separate post, that there were many, many things I loved about this con: including the focus on transformative works craft, the multi-fandom attendees and the really fantastic efforts of accommodation the Con Staff made towards folks with special needs, including dietary. I have never, ever felt like a con staff cared more about each of its attendees on an individual basis.
Which is why when fail came, I was like "woah, what the fuck?!"
Sadly, I think much of the fail is a product of the fact that people have become defensive. People are scared of these discussions, and I have to say while they are often unfun and heartbreaking (who wants to be the target of this stuff? who wants to realize they've hurt people or a community they care about no matter how inadvertently?) -- jeez they are not going to kill you, and they certainly aren't a reason to fail more.
Then I had to leave to catch my flight.
And then apparently other things happened that people who were there and people who were on the panel will address at more length and more accurately than me, but the phone call I got at the airport included the report that someone got up and said they felt marginalized for being straight and that they felt marginalized for being in a fandom and having a child, and I can't not address this. (ETA: I have subsequently learned that in small post-panel discussions the woman's point was actually about age-ism in fandom, which is a very real and legitimate problem, but hopefully those discussions also highlighted how incredibly fail-y and rude it was to say "am I not fucked up enough to be in fandom?" -- I'm not fucked up for being queer and my friends aren't fucked up for being transfolk or PoC: further insight into events here: http://community.livejournal.com/writercon/228157.html / http://rahirah.livejournal.com/411832.html (same post, different comments)).
I am queer every day. And every once in a while I get to hang out in a queer space, such that I don't have to worry if I'm dressing femininely enough to get through airport security or if kissing my girlfriend on my street corner at 11:30 at night is really the best fucking idea in the world.
And I get that feeling marginalized even for a minute is weird and can be heartrending. I get this specifically as it applies to fandom: a lot of us were outcasts growing up, a lot of us don't have face-to-face fannish communities to be a part of where we live, and when we go to a con, we want everyone to be just like us. We don't want to be outcasts -- not still, not again.
But I gotta tell you something -- and this isn't about bias and oppression and marginalization, it's just about life -- it's what I learned from fencing, from learning to fight: We all die alone. And we all fight alone. And we all live alone. On some level, we are always, always, always in a space where no one can know what we are feeling and how strange and terrible and lonely we are -- whether we're straight white guys or people of color or queer folks or a mom at a con.
And in being who I am -- someone who is melancholy and mournful, who views the solid presence of other people in my life as a one-in-a-billion craps shoot I can't believe I won -- you have all my compassion, all my love, all my sympathy and all my interest, because that is, innately, how I react to people who, like me, who know this nature of aloneness. You are beautiful to me.
But you need to step back. Because no, you are not marginalized or oppressed because you are part of the dominant group and people who are part of other groups are stepping up to say that we want some damn consideration. Nor are you marginalized or oppressed because you chose to have a kid. I spent most of the weekend with a woman who is second-generation fen and her baby; we wrote fic together, talked about slash and hung out with her wife. So no matter how different you may feel from what you perceive to be the majority of fandom, no one is being oppressed because they have a kid -- if someone's rude to you, that's actually something else -- the -ism's are something way beyond rudeness or you feeling awkward or out of place.
Look, I don't like being part of a marginalized group. It's not fun or romantic. Some of us -- both in these groups and outside of them -- have to learn this, just as many of us have to go through the thing where we learn there's nothing cool or fun about poverty or having to whore (as opposed to choosing to engage in sex work) to put food on the table or get the damn rent paid.
And that's about all I'm capable of saying without resorting to a great deal of obscenity, so I'm going to stop there on this particular part of the situation.
The discussion included a hand-out of potential discussion questions, many of which I found mind-blowingly offensive (I've made a deal with at least one other attendee that we're going to post them all with our answers on LJ over the next week or so), and the woman hosting the panel repeatedly snarked on our table (we were not the only queer people speaking up, but we could, rather legitimately, be perceived as a unified force, as it were) for being articulate and was particularly dismissive to the two PoC people at our table (and the combination of "articulate" and PoC is one of those very loaded, sneaky RaceFail things that happen sometimes and that was seriously, seriously sketchy).
I was shocked and appalled, and while some of this woman's viewpoint would have been potentially useful on a panel, to be an individual with an agenda on a sensitive issue with unvetted programming?!?!?! -- WOW. Not Okay.
So what good came out of all of this for me personally:
- I have even more love and respect for my friends, especially having watched ones who don't want to have to be the educators on these issues do it anyway.
- I met some really cool new people.
- I did see people have ah-hah! moments.
- I did learn that there are actually large swathes of fandom that missed the RaceFail thing entirely, and so were just sort of getting caught up on how big the problems are.
- I did see the larger community of the con close ranks against fail when it happened.
- I feel more confident in the value of my being willing to talk about this stuff. I don't like falling on this grenade over and over again, but since no one expects me to be "nice" or "non-threatening" or "look the other way" I have more latitude to say what needs to be said.
- I have new frameworks for the discussion.
- Hey, the Carl Brandon society totally deserves my money.
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no subject
Date: 2009-08-04 03:33 am (UTC)Can we please tattoo this into everyone's forehead? Like, yesterday?
no subject
Date: 2009-08-04 01:14 pm (UTC)It was an uncomfortable panel to attend. To sit in a room, thinking that you've been "doing it right" and realizing with a sickening crawl that you've got some seriously misplaced smug was a huge reality check for me. I also realize that, despite my best efforts, there will probably be fail in this response. If there is anything that I took away from that panel it is that you're never "cured" of fail and that you need to be able to recognize it and do better the next time.
I was also the person who help select the moderator. Programming is...complicated. The "back-room" decisions that are made are like playing with dominos. You get everything lined up perfectly but as soon as you touch something the whole mess falls down in an ugly heap. The moderator (an ordained, practicing minister) was someone I knew from past panels who didn't shy away from tough topics and handled them gracefully. My decision was in no way based on the need to interpret for the panelist but rather to provide a buffer, if necessary. Not a buffer between the panelists and the audience, but more the audience and the panelists. You always hope that people will attend sensitive panels and not be dicks, but you never know if it is going to go off the rails. I was actually pleased that, after her role as pre-con coordinator, she merely introduced and stepped back, letting the panelists completely control the room.
Was this condescending? I didn't think so, and still don't but, after that panel and subsequent conversations (which have been incredible), I completely see how it could be interpreted as such and it is not a decision I'd make again.
While the staffing, scope and placement of any "ism"-related panels is something that we can vow to "fail better" at next time, what is really troubling is the fact that there were attendees who felt their voices weren't being heard and were actively being ignored. This is not something I'd heard even a whiff of but realize that you might be in a position to hear something different. This cannot be ignored. It is damaging to the individuals who felt margenilized and to the future success of the con. I know many people feel uncomfortable with confrontation or voicing their discomfort but without knowing more specifics (was it a particular panel or panelist?) it is difficult to rectify beyond making people aware that this is Not Cool and will not be tolerated by the Writercon concom. I'd be happy to take this issue off of LJ if it is a comfort issue for the individuals or if you have more details (you have my email).
Again, thank you. It is uncomfortable to read criticism of an event that you've poured years of your life into and it is a very human reaction to get defensive, but it is all necessary. In the past, when Writercon was much more mono-fandom, there were probably issues that were let slide because we were all "family". Bringing new perspectives and observations to the event are critically important and I know the conversations generated from the '09 event have had, and will continue to have, a profound impact on the Writercon community at large.
ETA: Wow, tl;dr. Apologizes for block-texting your comments.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-04 01:25 pm (UTC)As to people not being called on, in one case I was specifically asked not to name who I heard it from, because that person is already really tapped out from this experience. I heard about a similar thing at a different panel as well, and think I can get that information to get to you.
The third problematic thing of that nature, I've pretty much named names in the above post without naming names, but if it's unclear, feel free to contact me privately.
Here's the thing, which may not be clear from what I say above and may not be clear depending on how closely you've followed this thing online: you all did _much_ better, much much much better than most of the cons that have tried to deal with this stuff recently (see: PoC people on panels not about racism; your listening skills; understanding that identity comes in boxes bigger than black or white and straight or gay). Where there was fail in any official capacity, it was through good intentions or lack of information -- it was "failing well" and you've handled it all graciously, and I certainly can't expect you to make sure your attendees don't bring biases to the table in their own ways, so really, this isn't about "WriterCon fucked up" so much as it's about "wow, this is still so endemic in our communities it's really troubling."
Also, we all fuck up. All the time. It's just like Xionin said at one point, when you hear this stuff it's usually because the straw just broke the camel's back. It's death by a thousand papercuts a lot of the time, and no one hates you (or me!) for being one of those papercuts, but if you're in the blast radius, you're going to be in the blast radius.
The good stuff is coming soon, although possibly not til tomorrow as my partner is heading out of town then, and I will be not so much on keys tonight.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-06 08:28 pm (UTC)I have an annoying tendency to sit in the front of the class so I didn't note people not being called on, unless they were also sitting toward the front. I hate the idea that I was simply that blindly unaware of bias going on around me.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-06 08:34 pm (UTC)The bisexual thing is really, really complicated and fucked up. I'm bisexual, and I've definitely lashed on people in the past when my heart's gotten broken. I think I'm past it now, but I never underestimate anyone's ability (especially my own) to say the most awful thing they can think of when they are upset.
(also, I'm not trying to pick a fight with you over on the other thread, but I may be failing! -- precisely because I lack that extra dose of patience which would make my status in these things easier for me to deal with and easier for other people who have to listen to me deal with it).
no subject
Date: 2009-08-06 08:56 pm (UTC)What I'm trying to explain, and possibly utterly failing, in the other thread, is that a roomful of people (many of them people of privilege) could have had growing understanding and appreciation completely derailed by what could be viewed as an unfair attack. I think the lady who got shouted down was, like me, someone who doesn't do well with public speaking and completely fumbled her lead in. I just wish she'd been allowed to finish because I think the response would have been something along the line of, "Well, why didn't you just say so?" and understanding would have ensued.
BTW, I completely agree that piling all the isms in one panel made it far too broad for particularly meaningful discussion.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-06 09:02 pm (UTC)And it wasn't someone on the panel who basically shouted them down (my understanding from my friends on the panel (which is also worth noting, people who are really close to me are in pain over this, so I'm all up in my cranky for a lot of reasons) was there was this moment of just being stunned and then things flowed from there) -- I know they are working on posts about it, which are probably more useful than what I've got on the subject.
(no subject)
From:(no subject)
From:(no subject)
From:no subject
Date: 2009-08-12 05:51 pm (UTC)There was a single panel entitled "Evil in Our Midst: Dealing with racism, sexism and homophobia in fandom."
Ugh. Lumping the three together in one lone panel was not a good plan. Fail was inevitable after that. Also hate the "evil" bit, as it feeds into the defensiveness.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-12 11:00 pm (UTC)However, there was one bit that made me go woah! - it was when you were talking about people having kids. Now, since we don't know one another, and this is your space, I have no idea if you would welcome me expanding on my woah!, hence my post here - might you welcome it?
no subject
Date: 2009-08-12 11:02 pm (UTC)With that clarification out of the way, have at!
no subject
Date: 2009-08-13 01:16 am (UTC)Also for clarification, I wasn't there at the con, and in any case, taking what I've read about it, thought what this audience member said (whatever she intended) was utterly skeevy, and needed to be called out. But this post really has nothing to do with her or whatever she felt or said, it was to do with your general point on the marginalisation (or not) of people with kids. I'm with you on the not comparing people being assholes to people with kids to the experience of being a PoC or an LGBTQ person. But (there's always a but), I think the thing about folks with kids not being a marginalised group is mostly but not entirely right.
On the "mostly right" bit: having kids can give you all kinds of societal approval, and all sorts of ways to pass - it can make your queerness invisible or unthreatening, for example, and it can give you cookies for doing what some sections of society say is what a woman is "supposed" to do with her life, and so on, I do know this.
On the "not entirely right" bit: again, I don't know you, so have no idea what your life experience is or what you intended, but the way you illustrated your opinion with the story of hanging out with your friend read to me as "See! I know someone with a baby who manages it fine! So there's no problem there!" But the bit in that story which really stood out for me was the "...and hung out with her wife" sentence, because the experience of parents who have co-parents or other caregivers is so very, very different to lone parents. Perhaps cons are full of single parents who manage it fine, I don't know, but even when just considering the physical issues, it can be impossible as a single parent (especially when intersectionality comes into play) to successfully navigate, say, going to the loo on a train, or go to a meeting past 6pm, or getting out of the house at all, never mind going to a con. I would not describe myself, and I don't know any other lone parents who would describe themselves as "oppressed", or have compared, in my hearing, their experiences of single motherhood with their experiences of being a PoC or a LGBTQ person, but I know plenty who, like me, feel that it is one of the things that contributes mightily to our marginalisation.
But: I don't want to derail your original main points further than I already have. Having received your permission to post this post on your lj, if you would prefer to take any further to-ing and fro-ing (should there be any - I'm not assuming there necessarily will be) to my lj, or to PMs, that would be fine.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-19 04:05 am (UTC)Here from metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 03:56 am (UTC)Gah! I normally don't get too upset over this anymore (just explain semi-calmly that yes, bisexuality does exist and no, just because I am currently dating a woman/man/personwhodoesnotidentifywitheitherbianary does not make me straight/gay/etc) but I had this coversation three times this weeks (and it's only Tuesday). And, really, you have Jack Harkness, omnisexual, leading the characters on Torchwood and you are going to deny that a sexual orientation exists outside of the gay/straight binary? I don't understand people who see things this way.
Thank you for writing this up. I do not attend cons, but they seems to have so many ripples in the online fandom communities that it is nice to know what the major issues were.
Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 09:03 pm (UTC)Uh...if this is another pile on the white, heterosexual, capitalist patriarchy, please find another approach to this argument because that's what it has become.
For many of the "marginalized or oppressed", it's become a tool to emotionally blackmail others.
In case you haven't noticed, those who identify as "marginalized or opressed" based on race, sexual orientation, or gender are doing just fine and even getting "free passes" for having such "compelling life stories".
Any white guy up for Supreme Court Justice who didn't immediately identify and discuss the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution would have been shredded when asked by a Senate Confirmation panel "Do you have the right to self-defense?"
Although that's probably a bad example because the Senate is filled with a bunch of idiots too. But then what the Hell were Minnesota voters thinking when they elected Al Franken?
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 09:11 pm (UTC)Telling people how to write in their own space is extremely poor manners. If you don't like it, no one is forcing you to read or comment.
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-20 07:50 am (UTC)It was posted to Metafandom, therefore the "own space" argument is questionable.
If you wanted the non-anonymous version, I spoke up at Worldcon. In person. Yeah, I got "silenced" by the intolerant academic liberal mob. It was the "we know better than you" arrogance routine. I got the "Oh, you just don't get it" crap. I got the "being 'color-blind' makes you oblivious to the problem" Live Journal screed.
Excuse me? Wasn't it Martin Luther King, Jr who said: "Do not judge me by the color of my skin, but judge me by the content of my character."
You want an identity? Respect MY culture and values. Feel free to disagree, but I'm calling YOU out on the utter hypocrisy that the Live Journal crowd typically displays.
Besides YOU WON in the US. YOU are now the "dominant hegemony". YOU control the White House, Senate, and Congress. YOU will soon have control of the Supreme Court. Be happy. President Obama has been annointed to solve all problems. (Okay, that was over the top, but you "live" by Marxist theory, you "die" by Marxist theory.)
I spent $1,500 to make my annual pilgrimage to Worldcon to celebrate the SF genre. My fun time was eaten by this bullshit. Your "allies" invaded the "space" I've shared with my fellow SF fans for DECADES. Please take up a collection and reimburse me for ruining my vacation.
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-20 02:28 pm (UTC)Some people have real problems, you know.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-20 03:16 pm (UTC)Must...withstand...the...irony....
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-20 04:38 pm (UTC)Re: Via Metafandom
From:Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 09:14 pm (UTC)http://www.derailingfordummies.com/#oppression
http://www.derailingfordummies.com/#asbad
Next?
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 09:22 pm (UTC)Don't like, you can avoid. To bad the back button doesn't exist for people IRL.
no subject
Date: 2009-08-19 09:37 pm (UTC)Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 10:28 pm (UTC)Oh, please. If you're going to do this, have pity for the poor lawyers in the audience, and find a hypothetical where there's at least a colorable argument that you might be right.
For the record, the circumstances in which you have a right of self-defense are complex, not always obvious, and subject to variation depending upon, inter alia, where you are. And the Second Amendment has nothing to do with it -- or, nothing to do with any reasonable case in which the issue is likely to arise.
In conclusion: Better Trolls, Please. The stupid, it burns.
Re: Via Metafandom
Date: 2009-08-19 10:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-08-22 01:24 am (UTC)I've been browsing posts about WriterCon since I didn't attend. Thanks for this post, I found it interesting (and it's helped to remind me that I have a meta post on the absence of bisexuality in fanfic that I need to finish writing).
The discussion included a hand-out of potential discussion questions, many of which I found mind-blowingly offensive (I've made a deal with at least one other attendee that we're going to post them all with our answers on LJ over the next week or so)
I looked through your journal and didn't see this. Did I overlook it? Have you not yet had a chance to do it? Did you decide not to?