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sundries

On the train this morning a small child was singing: "Spider filled with rabies. Rabies rabies rabies. Spider filled with rabies. Rabies rabies rabies!" It made my morning.

Speaking of bugs, it's an exciting week in Rach and Patty land as we're going to see Ovo on Thursday.

shes_unreal needs some help getting a better job to get out of a bad situation. It's complicated, so I'll let her explain. Reliable source, real person, real situation. Please help if you can.

A fandom auction is being run to help

thdancingferret who's job was evil and found a way to fire her for having cancer. Because the need is immediate, bidding closes tomorrow. Go now.

Yesterday on Twitter I linked to this giant sinkhole story before they included any info about the sinkhole, just the picture with no explanation whatsoever. Patty and I had a good time reading the comments (and subsequent ones on Twitter) to each other. They involved a remarkable number of references to "orbital lasers." But that sinkhole? Serious business.

Americans at the Bolshoi. One of the things that interests me is a passing mention that it is "all but taboo" for dance teachers to touch their students in California. I recall having a similar frustration in fencing -- take my limbs and show them where to go! That's how dance was when I was studying, but that was the 70s and 80s, and I guess the world changed; I am glad it hasn't everywhere.

Turns out there's more girls than boys in NYC's gifted programs and, as usual, The New York Times is alarmed. Meanwhile, people shrug and say "well, that's a shame" about all the ways boys of favored over girls. You'd think it would be okay for girls to be better than boys once in a while.

Lovely gay-themed ad for McDonalds from France. Although, when I first saw it, I thought McDonalds was going to be the host of this kid's coming out conversation with his father. But that's not the plot, which makes it all a little bit realer.

A history of trans and trans-like veterans that I should actually get around to checking out, since I reference stuff like this in that Snape, Gender and Heroism project I should actually write up for publication somewhere.

Last night on Buffy and Angel:

So, it was finally time for "Seeing Red," and my feelings are largely ambivalent. I don't think what Spike did (whether it was rape, attempted rape, threatened rape, etc.) was out of character -- we see him physically and sexually bully women both pre- and post- chip. I did find Buffy's response out of character -- not that she was startled, afraid and weak/injured, but just that what the show has argued as her automatic (not learned, most of us forget what we've learned when we're in danger) fighting abilities were not there. Also, I hated how the scene was overlit, although it was also interesting at the end how the scene where Buffy is talking to Xander before Warren shows up with a gun is also overlit. Also this whole thing doesn't stop me from being engaged with Spike as a character -- that's the great thing about fiction, I can like totally shit people who do totally shit things because their use in a narrative is brain stimulating on some level.

I found Tara's death to be startling, even though I knew about it (I didn't know it was this episode), and well done. I did not find it to be homophobic. Willow and Tara were the last couple standing, and if Whedon wanted all the couples doomed and they'd just gotten back together, that's what he had to do. I also appreciated that prior to the shooting Willow and Tara finally read like people who actually fuck, as opposed to the way lesbians usually read on TV, which is as people who pet each other gently and don't really have sex.

Xander was SUCH AN ASSHOLE in this ep I thought I was going to throw something at the TV.

Loved the Spike/Anya thing.

Meanwhile on Angel, Cordy is some mother goddess demon of love who I assume will eventually sacrifice her life so that Angel can become mortal. Connor is fucked up (and where do I know that kid from) and Holtz has bad make-up and a fucked up plan. Lila is courting Wesley and none of this is going to end well.

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Yoga too. When I first started taking yoga classes down here the instructors would grab my hips and swivel them, massage our necks, lift our heads and straighten them for shivasana...now they are extremely careful to not touch skin as they lay a pillow over the eyes and that's all you get. Half the time they're repeating themselves three times as we all try to figure out who they are talking too as well as how to apply it to our bodies if its us. I miss the contact.

Well, mostly I miss the classes, but also the contact.

On the train this morning a small child was singing: "Spider filled with rabies. Rabies rabies rabies. Spider filled with rabies. Rabies rabies rabies!" It made my morning. — This brings back fond memories of the "Dead Pigeons" song my then six-year-old brother made up in Venice.
I heard about the Guatemala City Giant Sinkhole at io9.com, where the lede was "No, this image is not Photoshopped." First the volcano, then the ongoing oil-spill nightmare in the Gulf, now this — when did life turn into a Roland Emmerich film?
Also this whole thing doesn't stop me from being engaged with Spike as a character -- that's the great thing about fiction, I can like totally shit people who do totally shit things because their use in a narrative is brain stimulating on some level. — This gives me hope for all the girls who are nuts over Edward the Sparklepire.
Meanwhile on Angel, Cordy is some mother goddess demon of love who I assume will eventually sacrifice her life so that Angel can become mortal. Connor is fucked up (and where do I know that kid from) and Holtz has bad make-up and a fucked up plan. Lila is courting Wesley and none of this is going to end well. — I'm fascinated by how your predictions for the show swerve from spot-on to way off. I think overall you've had more hits than misses. I'm not sure where you would have seen Vincent K other than Angel and Mad Men, but he's striking, isn't he?

Actually... Buffy's reaction didn't bother me. She's a warrior, yes. But, this was an attack from someone she trusted on some level. Someone she had really conflicted feelings about. I'd believe that on some level, she was somewhere caught between shock and thought.

I've been trying to think of male gay characters, and the only out-and-proud one I can think of is Larry (who of course sadly died during Graduation Day).

And there's Andrew, but he's still pretty far back in the closet.

I read the over lit spike attack on Buffy as a sort of starkness, a grim way of saying "We're not pretending this isn't what it is. We've had a threat of rape subtext for five seasons, but now we're dragging that into the light."

I have mixed feelings about Buffy not fighting back effectively. The times I've been attacked by friends/acquaintances, it shocked the fuck out of me, but I did keep my head and I did fight back effectively. (Go go gadget kung fu training). At the same time, I can easily see it be so shocking to the person it is happening it too that they would freeze. I've never been attacked like that by someone I'd been fucking. I bet that would be a hell of a lot more shocking.

I'd rather she fought back effectively, I really would. At the same time, I can see how it might go down the way it did.

I agree that Buffy's complete ineffectiveness at fighting back was startlingly inconsistent with how her fighting abilities and strength had been portrayed up to that point. When I managed to revisit the ep from a much more detached POV, as opposed to the first time I saw it which triggered some shit for me, that was one of the things that really stood out.

This, however, is why I can't deal with post-S6 Spuffy. I'm all for redemption themes and such, but I can't suspend disbelief enough to buy that somehow they go from there to any sort of romantic relationship. Which I realize is at least in part about my own issues and triggers, and is all tangled up with rage over the "falling in love with your (would-be, in this case) rapist" trope. However, as I've noted before, this is very much a minority view in Buffydom, as Spuffy does seem to be the dominant ship.

I was only tangentially in the fandom when "Seeing Red" aired, but I do remember the huge storm of anger that erupted over Tara's death. My initial reaction before seeing other fans' response was just to be sad that a character I loved, who had finally appeared in the opening credits, leading me to believe she was finally a firm part of the team, was gone. That was, in fact, one of the things that I saw people freak out over, some in the same way I had and some with a much more profound sense of betrayal by this. I quickly gathered that many young lesbian fans, in particular, were in a place of feeling deeply betrayed by the fact that not only had this much-loved character been killed off, but also that there was that setup at the start of the ep that gave a false sense of, "Oh, good, she's definitely here to stay." While that may have had more to do with giving Amber Benson a full credit before she left the show, it is something that had been done before deliberately (with Jesse in the very first episode), though not with an established character. I like to think that if Whedon and whomever else was involved with that decision had realized just how deeply personally some would take that bait-and-switch, they might have handled it differently, but of course, we'll never know.

The other thing that came up a lot was the trope of the "crazy, evil, or dead lesbian," in particular that the pattern in popular media of making a lesbian character lose her mind or get killed as soon as it's become clear she's actually having sex with her lover. It's not a pattern I'd recognized before or even heard of, but that was the theme of a lot of the enraged meta. Not that it was homophobic to break Willow/Tara, because as you point out, all the couples were broken one way or another by this point, so they were hardly singled out. But that the way it was done was perpetuating that stereotype. I'm ashamed to have to admit that all these years later, I still don't really have enough lesbian popular culture under my belt to speak to that myself, but I imagine that's a meta discussion that it would have been very interesting to hear you weigh in on at the time. I haven't the foggiest if I can even find any of it to point you to now however, though I think I'll poke around a bit this afternoon to try.

bait-and-switch

I'm sitting here with my jaw hanging open but that is probably the phrase I hear most often about some of the rage peopel feel about Ianto's death on Torchwood as various creators had said pre S3, that we'd really love CoE. And, while I did, a lot of people who were invested in it for Jack/Ianto _really_ didn't. The "false advertising" thing comes up over and over again, although in the case of Buffy I do see it as an intentional fake out, because at the end of "Seeing Red" you can't really be 100% sure Tara is gone.

As to what happened with CoE, I've not the energy to rehash and refute today.

It's almost impossible not to compare the two. I'd started to, in fact, then deleted the whole paragraph, because some of it gets into how things were handled not only for the rest of S6 but well into S7, including the AfterElton.com article that really looks at how both character deaths were handled both with regard to the other characters on-screen and with regard to the fan reaction off-screen.

One thing I couldn't help but think in the wake of CoE, though, was, "Dude, how can you be such a Whedon fan and not know this was exactly how the fans would react?"

Edited 2010-06-01 16:00 (UTC)

That is the thing about being a Joss fan - you become deeply distrustful of 'happiness'. Whenever the characters are happy we assume crash positions because we know it means that HORRIBLE THINGS WILL HAPPEN! (If we're *lucky* no one dies permanently.)

(When you're through both shows I shall link you to a post that lays out PTJS 'Post-Traumatic Joss Syndrome'.)

Seeing Tara get shot broke my heart on Willow's behalf, especially since I'd been rooting for them to get back together ever since they'd started fighting. I'm not sure why people saw a homophobic undertone in that scene, though.

And about Spike, that scene horrified me and yet didn't totally kill my love for his character. I always felt weird about that. His role in the seventh season certainly helps.

Seeing Red: I didn't think Spike was out of character at all, I simply rather resented that Buffy's situation was so contrived; as well, I thought it was rather disingenuous of the show to treat Buffy's sexual bullying of Spike as humourous whereas when he did it back, it was all OMG RAPE. Their relationship had not been "safe, sane, or consensual" by a long shot, she is A LOT stronger than him, and she'd been using him as her sex toy regardless of his feelings (except for taking advantage of such), and on one occasion, when he'd been actually telling her "No" while she was doing it. But that was funny. Remember that episode of Angel, where Buffy shows up and hits him across the face, and then he just hauls off and hits her back? And she's like, "you hit me!" all girly and outraged, and he says, "you hit me first, and also you're stronger than me!" Anyway, I don't even think he did anything wrong, considering the parameters of their relationship; how was he to know that THIS TIME was different, and she wouldn't just stop him if she wanted to? But it's lit and shot like rape, and that's what I didn't like about it.

Willow & Tara: SNIFF. My only other problem with this is, though it was beautifully done, that I hate when they bring guns into the Buffyverse as it seems to invalidate all other occasions -- why does no one else do this, if it's an option? But all the emotional and cinematographical moments are drop dead gorgeous. (heh. literally.)

Connor & Wesley/Lilah & Wesley in general are literally the only things I would save from S4 Angel. The rest of it can die in a fire as far as I am concerned.

Seriously, was no one disturbed when just a few episodes age Buffy beat the shit out of Spike? I could barely watch that, and I don't think I'm displaying a gendered double-standard here.

Xander was SUCH AN ASSHOLE in this ep I thought I was going to throw something at the TV.

I know exactly how you feel. I have a hard time rewatching the show in large part because Xander's actions in season six made me hate him so much that I can't even go back and watch young Xander without wanting to throw stuff at my television every time he appears. He's such a controlling misogynist "nice guy (TM)" jerk and he never really gets called on it--I'm pretty sure the writers had no idea how offensive his behavior actually is.

Loved the Spike/Anya thing.

Yes. In my personal canon, they totally ran off and lived questionably-redeemed-demon lives together happily ever after. (There was a lot of good Spike/Anya fic at the time, from embittered former Spuffies who couldn't get over the beating in "Dead Things" and attempted rape in "Seeing Red.")

"Seeing Red" is such a problematic mess. I'm so angry about the writers using rape as a plot device to push their agenda (they thought the audience was too sympathetic to Spike and not sympathetic enough to Buffy, so they decided to punish us for liking the "wrong" character). It was such a shift from the previous portrayal of the Spike/Buffy relationship, which was very much "they're both messed up and they're both making mistakes." It was like, they wanted things to go back to Buffy = good, Spike = bad, and ... I don't know, attempted rape is such a skeevy way to get that emotional reaction from their audience, and it still doesn't erase the more complicated relationship that came before. At the same time, I can't really love Spike as a character any more, because as much as I felt that scene was a manipulation by the writers, it happened and it's horrible.

(The fan wars over that episode were so horrible. It still surprises me to see that people can talk about it without the comments turning into a friendship-destroying real tears flamewar.)

I didn't think Tara's death was homophobic, exactly--it would've been weird if every other couple fell apart but the lesbians were protected. This way they're real characters and suffer just like the others do. And the writers went way out of their way to make Tara sympathetic and to make Warren the most misogynist jerk imaginable--the audience was clearly supposed to love Willow/Tara and to mourn Tara. And, afterward, they still had Willow and she stayed gay (thankfully--it would've been horrible if she'd dated a guy next). But at the same time, I totally understand how broken-hearted and angry the Willow/Tara fans were--people were profoundly invested in that ship, much like I assume many Jack/Ianto fans were.

Don't want to spoil you, but am very curious what you'll think of developments on the Lilah/Wesley front.

Yeah, the beating was terrible. She never apologizes either. And also, the part where she's invisible, and is trying to fuck him, and he's like, "No, really, stop." and then she's invisibly giving him a blowjob, and he's like, "Oh, that's unfair." But that's funny, right? UGH.

I thought they had a very equal relationship of fucking each other up in dysfunctional s&m-y ways, and I LOVED IT. (They are totally my favorite canonical couple). That's why I thought Seeing Red cheaped out -- it suffered from the Harry Potter problem of "well, when the hero does it, it's okay" and added an extra dollop of "when a girl does it, it's okay" that really bugged me.

(sorry to drop in like this...)

I don't know if that was ever explicitly canon, but the guy in Provider who (as it turns out) hired Angel to get his dead boyfriend's watch back? I always thought that was touching and (for a change) non-awkward...

EXCEPT for the part that it's never clarified that it's a boyfriend. It's completely murky and ambiguous like they couldn't have a gay man on the show who wasn't a punchline. I wanted to love it and was just BOGGLED.

We were. Spike fans were up in arms.

I thought that scene was brilliant at the time, because it illustrated what was so wrong in Buffy's part of the the Buffy/Spike relationship--not that she was dirtying her precious self with an icky vampire, but that she was using and abusing someone who loved her. I loved that scene because it was so obvious and I was sure that they were going to address it and deal with it.

But no, instead we got the attempted rape, and everything they "dealt with" afterward was how bad Spike was. As if the attempted rape erased the beating, and all of the questionably-consensual emotionally and physically abusive bullshit Buffy put Spike through before it. (Not in any way that Spike was an innocent, but that still doesn't make the way Buffy treated him okay.)

AHHHH I love the McDonald's ad! You're right about it being more real -- but what clinched it for me was the son's smile at the end. It wasn't a pained look of "Oh no, when the day comes that I have to tell you, my life will be over" -- instead, it was "Wait till you find out MY awesome secret!" It was so positive, and now I am filled with glee.

You're of course right, I'm sorry. I haven't watched Angel in a while; my memory was probably making it less ambiguous than it actually is.

^ Feeling this entire thread.

"Dude, how can you be such a Whedon fan and not know this was exactly how the fans would react?" Exactly - and James Moran talked openly about th parallels with this episode of Buffy, how he too reacted strongly to Tara's death, and yet somehow Ianto's death was not going to provoke JUST such a shitstorm from fans? Maybe Moran was sincerely clueless, but I doubt very much whether RTD was - maybe he was trying to out-Joss Joss?

Kinda awesome to be talking about Buffy again. I keep thinking about maybe pulling out my dvds and doing a rewatch!

The first time I watched season 6, a few years ago (I, too, am a late comer to the Buffyverse), the episodes between Smashed and Seeing Red convinced me that Spike and Buffy were in an abusive relationship and that Buffy was more of the abuser than Spike. It was all too easy to see the signs, especially after Dead Things (where Buffy beats the shit out of Spike) and Older and Far Away (where he shows up at the party and skirts around the issue of his obvious bruises).

By the time we get to the bathroom in Seeing Red, I can totally believe Spike trying to woo Buffy in the same manner she's used on him, violence.

If trying to make Spike be the evil vampire again, they failed miserably.

I saw his actions as being totally in character and a logical extension of the mess that was their relationship. I saw Buffy as being as much at fault in the mess that was their relationship and her actions, especially in Dead Things, where she beat him unconscious and left him in the alley to possibly meet the sun.

She definitely had the power in that relationship and she abused it, several times, in several ways.

Maybe. The big difference off-screen was the reaction to the fans, I think. Joss' response boiled down to, "I know, it was really hard to kill her, but sometimes the story demands what it does." That, even if you disagree with whether the character death served the narrative or not, is much less inflammatory than the eye-rolling about "hysterical women." That and the way the grief of the other characters was handled on-screen are some of the reasons I think there are still plenty of fans, myself included, who mourn Tara (or Wash) and may still write AUs out the wazoo where things work out differently, but the level of rage subsided a lot more quickly, whereas some of the post-CoE rage has subsided, but much definitely has not and doesn't look like it's about to. So, if RTD was trying to out-Joss Joss, which may or may not be the case, I have no idea, but if he was, I think he missed a rather key piece.

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sundries

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