sci-fi fantasy lit column!

[rm]

So I'm going to be doing a column for Gather on the world of sci-fi and fantasy literature. My introductory piece is going on be on the ascendancy of this genre and why it's not what the people who aren't immersed in it generally denigrate it as. If any of you want to talk to me about why you enjoy this work and what it means to you and how the reception your interest in it as a consumer has evolved over the years, please leave comments and let me know if I can quote you if you provide this info in your comments. I am excited about this!

But, they want a catchy title to help brand it. What the hell should I call it?

Also exciting: a big check for some writing I did will be here exactly when I need it.

Comments

[zarq.livejournal.com]

I'll comment within the next 24 hours. What's your deadline? :)

Also, many, MANY people on my flist could comment on this for you, if they feel inclined. Would you like me to ask them to do so?

[rm.livejournal.com]

Please. I have a couple of weeks for my introductory piece, so take your time.

[zarq.livejournal.com]

Thank you. My recovery has been difficult and the extra time is really appreciated.

I'll post this evening, though -- to give people some time to respond. :)

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Oh, posting links! I can do that. Much easier than trying to come up with something articulate about my own reasons.

[devikun.livejournal.com]

Hi, came here via wordsofastory to try and be helpful...

Not sure what you mean by 'reception' though; if you mean the reception of others to the fact that I read fantasy, that carefully interested look that appears on people's face when I mention it, then that hasn't really changed much for me. Most people still look that way. I generally don't discuss it (like some dirty secret? "I read...(mutter) fantasyfiction" *cough), but only because I can usually spot the people who don't get it and the people who do, or are genuinely willing to at least. For the don't gets, if I make such a social faux pas, I move on quickly to some other topic; the effort of trying to convince them some of this stuff is actually staggeringly good exceeds my care factor that they leave the conversation convinced...

But some of it is staggeringly good. I've been reading fatasy since middle high school (more than 10 years now), and the more I read, the higher my expectations become and the more refined my likes and dislikes. I have less tolerance now than I did then for 'crap'. There's stuff that I've read I've thought was horrid, and stuff I flat out refuse to read because I know it will be horrid. I've read a lot of the so-called must reads and been burned by long-running series and hard-to-get final volumes (and I don't care how good Robert Jordan is supposed to be - I'm not interested in never ending series). I've paid my dues as a fan and I feel like it's my consumer right to be harsh, judegmental and hard to please.

But I've also matured enough to realise that 'crap' is a subjective label and all those D&D and Forgotten Realms out there - someone likes them, it's just not *me*. And that's fine. I'll stick to my Parker and my Erikson and my Martin and when they stop pleasing me, I'll mourn and then find someone else.

And when someone starts talking to me about Prachett (who is hugely entertaining I know but whom I just can't get excited about) then I'll be the one listening with the carefully interested look on my face.


Err, so I don't know if that's helpful or anything, but you can quote me if you want, and feel free to ask me questions if you need to too!

[conch-fritter.livejournal.com]

Sent here by wordsofastory. I'm a huge s.f. nut and I took this class about the history of s.f. literature a few years ago and it was wonderful. I think people like it so much because it stretches our imagination into realms that more modern-day, non-fiction ideas don't explore. People love an adventure. And as much as we like to deny it, we love that thrill that walking into the 'unkown' gives us.

Personally, I find fantasy and sci-fi also encompass so many other areas that it's easy to find something that suits my particular fancy. Being a scientist, I love futuristic sci-fi or fantasy, and content that involves some sort of deep, thought-provoking plot... but there's alot of diversity. I also love to pick up a sci-fi magazine and read short stories.

And heh, that's alot of useless information from a stranger, I'm sure. Thanks for offering the opportunity to ramble on the subject. :) Also, if you're looking for a good read, pick up 'Science Fiction, A Historical Anthology' by Eric Rabkin. It's a collection of short s.f. stories from the 16- to 1900s. It's un-intrusive and worth picking up!

[lllvis.livejournal.com]

I'm more than willing to contribute! Although lately I'm not quite the sci-fi/fantasy ready I used to be, but I can still provide comments and yes, you would be free to quote me.

I enjoy sci-fi and fantasy and yes I treat them as entirely seperate genres. As a younger reader, say later teens into my 20's, I read a wider variety of things. I eventually developed certain limitations for what I enjoyed which more often than not had to do with presentation and basis. In other words, the more fantastic the setting and/or story, the better the basis had to be. By basis I mean something I can relate to, not necessarily anything 'real life' (although that helps) but presented in a way that makes sense to me. Without that, I'd lose interest quickly.

I wish I could recall the author I tried to read at one point that epitomized what I just couldn't bring myself to enjoy. She obviously had a love for gaelic history and incorporated that, as well as what I presume was the ancient gaelic language, into her story. THAT made it more of a chore to read than anything else, and like many chores I didn't exactly find it enjoyable, much less fulfilling for having done so!

However, I can thank the genre's of sci-fi and fantasy for introducing me to other classic literature. I found The Price, The Art of War, and The Book Of Five Rings all thanks to sci-fi and fantasy authors who referenced them in their writings.

=======

A title for your story? "Judging books by their cover" springs to mind but sounds a bit worn...

[p-zeitgeist.livejournal.com]

Hi, Brigdh sent me, too.

One thing I've noticed, which might be of interest or might be completely useless to you, is the degree to which familiarity with fantasy and science fiction has become the norm in so-called Left Blogistan. Hang out on any of the major progressive political blogs, and eventually you'll notice that a familarity with the classics of the field, and with at least a layer of pop f&sf culture on top of that, is pretty much a given. Everybody is familiar with Buffy. Most people will get a reference to the Three Laws of Robotics, and nobody will raise a virtual eyebrow over it lowering the tone. It's become the mainstream, at least for one (increasingly influential) tranche of our political and intellectual culture. And there was a time when that just wasn't true.

[dien.livejournal.com]

Hey RM. *waves* I friended you after Yuletide because I just enjoyed your piece that much (and you seemed like an insanely interesting person) but haven't actually said hi, so.... *cough* Hi. ;) And I'm de-lurking because I like talking about SF/fantasy too much not to.

Let's see: why I enjoy this work. *skritches head* By which I assume you mean why I enjoy the sci-fi genre. I think it partly has to do with the amazing freedom it represents for the writer-- in sf/fantasy so many of the things that must be dealt with metaphorically can just be shoved out not as metaphors but as realities. As an example, let me describe a short SF story I read years ago that made a mark on my mind. (Regrettably, I do NOT remember the title, or author, or the SF anthology it appeared in, which frustrates me ENDLESSLY, I assure you. If anybody here recognizes it from my synopsis, I'd love to know the name of it.)

The story was set in a future in which mankind had achieved the ability, through a drug regimen/surgical procedure, to arrest the aging process and become, essentially, immortal. They had also colonized other worlds and had what, at first glance, was a rather Utopian society. Only one human settlement still contained people who died of old age-- the community of Renaissance, on Earth. ('Renaissance' may have been the title, but I'm not sure.) Renaissance was a community of artists/writers/musicians-- those involved in the creative arts-- who voluntarily elected not to undergo the surgery to make them immortal. The immortal humans of the story could still create if they desired, but their work tended to be inferior, to lack the spark that would make the true masterpiece. The story focused on a young boy named David who was taken to Renaissance as a possible candidate, and his eventual choice regarding immortality/mortality.

The basic premise was that man creates in order to live forever-- that's why we make masterpieces, whether in music, art, or literature; in order that something of our selves lives on beyond death. This idea is not new, obviously; ars longa, vita brevis; but seeing that in a story that presented an alternative (of living literally forever) made the basic concept much more powerful to me.

Science fiction, and fantasy, rewrites the world in a form in which the merely hypothetical questions are no longer hypothetical; in which allegory is instead the reality. Science fiction and fantasy use the 'other', whether it's elves or aliens, to make us ask questions about ourselves. Science fiction and fantasy do the same thing as "regular" fiction-- holding up a mirror to show us what we are-- but in this genre, the mirror is warped, and thus shows us things the flat mirror never can.

Also, there's lots of explosions. Which I like.

Of course there's elements of escapism and all the rest of it, but that's hardly something unique to SF/fantasy. I think any form of fiction offers some level of escapism, or it's not fiction; and I think the spy or detective or romance novel can, depending on the reader, be just as much an "escape" from reality as anything with spaceships or magic swords. The fact remains that the best sci-fi/fantasy, the stories that change us, have, I think it's fair to say, considerably more range than the best examples of other genre fiction. To throw out another example:

The Sherlock Holmes stories-- arguably the standard by which detective fiction is judged (although Sir Arthur Conan Doyle never believed that what he was writing constituted "literature"). Genre fiction or not, such issues as racism ("The Adventure of the Yellow Face") and gender (to a degree, in "A Scandal in Bohemia") did occasionally make appearances in the works. Some stories revealed social issues, others were impromptu history lessons-- but at their heart each was a puzzle-- a mystery, of course.

(con't.)

[dien.livejournal.com]

(...continuing)

In contrast, some of the best science fiction/fantasy I've read often deals with racism, gender issues, social issues, religion, politics, sexuality, philosophy, etc, etc, within what is simply the context of an SF/fantasy world. Only in the lowest-end SF/fantasy is the story about the magical sword or the spaceship or the aliens; what the outsider generally deems the "hallmarks" of SF/fantasy, in the same way that the Love Scene/Declaration of Love is the hallmark of the romance, or the Solving Of The Case the hallmark of the detective thriller. SF/fantasy treats its accoutrements not as the point of the story, even if those accoutrements happen to play a large part in the plot, but as merely a starting point from which to tell any type of story.

(Arguably there are other examples of (non SF/fantasy) genre fiction in which the story is not "about the hallmarks" as I phrase it; they may well exist, but I haven't encountered them.)

This is part of the reason I sometimes have issues with sf/fantasy being called 'genre fiction'-- because it's far more flexible and adaptable than that label implies. Nobody who's a fan of Lord of the Rings thinks it's about the Ring; nobody who's a fan of Firefly thinks the story is about the spaceship; yet those who are not immersed in these types of literature are perfectly content to judge it by the words "magic ring" or "spaceship".


Um. I'm trying to think if I had an actual argument with this or if I was just babbling. Probably the latter. *skritches head* Hopefully I actually answered a question somewhere in there.

You're more than welcome to quote if any of it catches your eye; is dien all you need for quote-y purposes, or d'you want real names?

I read both SF and fantasy

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

I'm old-fashioned and pedantic enough to dislike the term "sci-fi", and once had the temerity to tell Forrest Ackerman so. I don't read fyction, I read fiction.

I do see the two genres as mostly distinct, though a few writers (Sheri S. Tepper, for one) manage to combine them.

I like much more sophisticated fantasy and SF than I did when I was younger, with believable characters.

I'm glad that certain genres within the genre have survived, for instance. I like medical SF, and I enjoy fantasy that plays with fairy tale themes in new ways. These themes will always attract me to pick up a book and at least look at it.

I'm 53, however, and don't find it necessary to finish a book if I don't like it. I'm not afraid of a romance, either.

I'm another reader who hates to have my favorite reading matter brushed off as "genre fiction" unless it turns out to be depressing, unintelligible, written by a mainstream author trying his (it's usually a man's) or her hand at SF or fantasy, and/or written about the Theme of the Year. Spare me!

[polydad.livejournal.com]

zarq hie'd me hither, and I've got a few opinions I'm not using --

I like SF because we the fans have required a much higher degree of both creativity and consistency from our authors than I find in mainstream fiction. One of the biggest thrills of being human is exploring the unknown, and things are only unknown until we get to know them. So inventing new unknowns for us to explore is a requirement in SF. See "Grendel" by Niven, for an example.

I respond much better to questioning; I do conversation much better than monologue. Have any questions?

best,

Joel

[shayguevara.livejournal.com]

I have some trouble with commenting as I feel the fantasy/sci-fi genre has really grown in the past 2 decades.

Although I am usually too hung up on the fact that this is one of the things about me that makes me a huge geekgirl (though I am becoming more proud of it by the moment), my interest stems back to reading Madeleine L'Engle books starting in the 2nd grade. Yes, 2nd grade. I was a bit advanced for an 8 year old. I think that is why I dug her books - I was into her Time Quartet (A Wrinkle in Time, etc.) and very much identified with Meg. In a college children's literature lecture it was pointed out to me that I probably liked her (and thus the books) because she was also an intellectual with "friend issues". Indeed.

I loved the way L'Engle wrote without "dumbing down" to children. If I didn't know what mitochondria were, I would have to find out. I would have to look at the scientific explanations of the space/time continuum. As the youngest child in my family (with the "oldest" mind),it made me feel big.

My father kicked off my Chronicles of Narnia phase - they had been his favorite as a child. I didn't read Tolkien until I was an adult and I think I enjoy Harry Potter more as an adult than I would have as a child. I could be wrong, but my imagination really runs wild with the story and I enjoy comparing it to other literature that may have influenced J.K. Rowling.

Some of my fantasy reading these days is escapism (Gregory Maguire books and the like) and some of it is based in nostalgia (such as the fact that I will be reading the Eragon series). Reading Lloyd Alexander's Chronicles of Prydain series (my husband insisted as they were his favorite as a child) gave me the thrill that reading had given me as a child while having the perspective to look at the series abstractly. I also thoroughly enjoy some of the female heroes in these books.

In some ways I enjoy children's sci-fi/fantasy best (Philip Pullman , et al.), but I have read quite a bit of adult s-f/f (mostly on recommendations from friends). Marion Zimmer Bradley (I am all about Arthurian fantasy, but I also enjoy her other books), Ray Bradbury and Guy Gavriel Kay are all authors that I started reading in adolescence and have continued to enjoy in adulthood.

Is this a decent start? I kind of feel like rambling...

Re: I read both SF and fantasy

[zarq.livejournal.com]

I like medical SF

Did you ever read Murray Leinster's Med Ship? It's quite dated now, but the stories are interesting.

Re: I read both SF and fantasy

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

It's been a long time, but I think I have. James White's stuff is getting dated too, but I love the humor.