sci-fi fantasy lit column stuff - romance!

[rm]

So as I work on the first intro article, I've been struck by a couple of ideas for future articles. One on great out-of-print stuff you should track down, and the other -- wait for it -- a Valentine's Day feature. Yes, that's right, the great (or completely compelling and utterly fucked up, to be more accurate) relationships in sci-fi and fantasy novels.

So far I've got a few on my nomination list (that is, some will make the piece and some won't) including Molly/Case from Neuromancer, Paul/Chani from Dune, Gentle/Pie from Imajica, Alec/Richard from Swordspoint, Phedre/Josclin from Kushiel's Dart, Asriel/Mrs. Coulter from HDM, Jodeau/Xas from The Vintner's Luck (this is the one most likely to get booted right now, as I'm using that book in the out-of-print piece).

But all of this speaks to my particualr biases of the moment. What am I forgetting? What haven't I read that I really should (I know, everything!)? Anyone got some f/f or poly ones for me to reference? I know they are in my brain somewhere, but they're not coming to the fore. As should be obvious from what's above, happily ever after not required. Also more hard sci-fi stuff welcome. I really like hard sci-fi, but I'm largely at a loss on it for this particular list (thank you, William Gibson for making me not look like a total pussy).

Comments

[drfardook.livejournal.com]

Nearly everything by Heinlein is poly. I read a great deal of it in high school but I don't think I could stand it now.

Dead Girls/Dead boys/Dead Things by Richard Calder (my nominee for ultimately fucked relationship)

There's also The Left Hand of Darkness for gender-free romance.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Omg, please, please let there be a poly option other than Heinlein. Please. You're right of course though. I blocked it out.

[drfardook.livejournal.com]

I'm struggling to think of something but so far the only thing I came up with is Michael Moorcock's Dancers at the End of Time series (An Alien Heat, The End of All Songs, etc) which is more a decadent anarchy society where anything goes because there's nothing left to do rather than any sort of social challenge.

Come to think of it, I can't think of any queer romances except in secondary characters.

[graene.livejournal.com]

Forbidden Tower by marion Zimmer Bradley is about a two couple/foursome situation. Oh! Courtship Rite by Donald Kingsbury. society is a base six-marriage ideal, this family winds up with seven spouses.

[realtsunamigirl.livejournal.com]

Can I put in a vote for he entire Long family from Heinlein's Future History novels. Lazarus, Ishtar, Hamadryad, Justin, Ira, Galahad, Minerva, Athene, Lor and Laz. They're an awfully great love story, if a little ovepopulated. And I'm sure that I've missed a person or two here.

[realtsunamigirl.livejournal.com]

oops. Just read the "no Heinlein please" caveat. Sorry. Why not, just out of curiosity?

[rm.livejournal.com]

I find him to often be a sloppy and repetative writer I have to make excuses for, and I hate that. yes, there's valuable and interesting stuff in many, many of his books, but giving the "don't be turned off by" speech tires me, and my own tolerance for the most perfectly brilliant and busty redheads in the entire world is perhaps lower than it should be when one considers the scope of his work.

Finally, Stranger in a Strange Land, which yes, everyone should read, is far too much the blueprint for too stuff I've run into over the years in both the pagan and poly communities, both good and bad. While I use books of all absurd sorts to help me pattern my life, any text that becomes a sole text for people alarms me -- whether it's Heinlein or the Bible. It's not Heinlein's fault really, but I find it hard to deal with.

Finally, everyone knows Heinlein and knows about poly in Heinlein. I want to make the argument that this stuff is hanging out in the genre in other places too.

[ladyofthelog.livejournal.com]

I have to admit, I adore Heinlein. But in the same way I enjoy the really bad romance novels I get at the grocery store.

Man, How to Marry a Millionare Vampire - that's the stuff!

[aynatonal.livejournal.com]

I was going to say Left Hand of Darkness too! Great minds think alike.

[blergeatkitty.livejournal.com]

Heinlein! Heinlein loves poly relationships. I'm not a diehard fan, so I'm sure there's one who could give you better advice than me, though. The "line marriage" in The Moon is a Harsh Mistress is the one that comes to mind, though there's not a lot of romance per se in that book.

[rm.livejournal.com]

As I said above:

Omg, please, please let there be a poly option other than Heinlein. Please. You're right of course though. I blocked it out.

hehe. I should add that to my post.

[blergeatkitty.livejournal.com]

well, it's true that Heinlein's not exactly a romantic guy...so we can render him ineligible. :)

[roadnotes.livejournal.com]

Delany: Babel-17 has two triads (I can't remember the names of all of the parties offhand, but Mollya Twa, Navigator One, is part of one (one triad is the three navigators of the ship; the other belonged to the poet captain). Dhalgren has a triad.

Also, Donald Kingsbury's Courtship Rite has a five-marriage seeking to become a six-marriage, in a lovely intricate culture in which human flesh is the primary source of protein on the planet, and if you don't prove yourself valuable enough, you can be a meal. And there's romance in it, too.

[habiliments.livejournal.com]

For something gender-vague - and relationship-undefinable, also, which is fun - there's Fitz and the Fool from two of Robin Hobb's deliciously thick trilogies.

I'm not much for hard sci-fi but I can't help but think of the main characters of Dan Simmons' Hyperion books - which aren't all spaceships and lasers but are more SF than F - particlarly the second two, which get worse and worse, and as go the books, so goes the relationship. It's downright unbearable by the end, but could make for a good example of fucked-uppedness.

I want to keep thinking about this, but alas, work beckons, and forcefully.

will self is not a sci fi writer

[saltbox.livejournal.com]

But his book, Great Apes is sci-fi, kinda. This artist wakes up (in a world of chimps) and thinks he was formerly human, and now turned into a chimp. (As I recall, the book leaves it ambiguous whether that thought has merit, or whether it's delusional.) Anyway, the book covers therapy sessions between the artist and this psychologist (an ape) to help him out of his delusion/"delusion," which includes the belief that monogamy (rather than the polyamory of chimps) should be the norm. It's kind of amusing.

[ladyaelfwynn.livejournal.com]

Here through gina_r_snape's flist...

Marion Zimmer Bradley touches on poly relations especially in Ruins of Isis and her Renunciate Darkover books. There are also some interesting romantic twists throughout the Mists of Avalon.

Throughout Anne McCaffrey's Pern books there are several couples including Sebell/Menolly, F'lar and Lessa, F'nor and Brekke, and Jaxom and Sharra.

There is significant romance throughout Katherine Kurtz's Deryni books. Specifically Rhys and Evaine/Elaine in the Camber of Culdi series and Kelson in the Histories of King Kelson.

Do you count Laurell K. Hamilton's Anita Blake series as fantasy? If so there are lots of romances, Anita and Jean Claude and Anita and Richard are the first to come to mind.

It's been a long while but, I think there are some poly relationships in Mercedes Lackey's Heralds of Valdemar series, the Last Herald Mage series, and Vow and Honor series, maybe Mage Winds but I can't remember.

There's an interesting treatment of sex in the military in Piers Anthony's Bio of a Space Tyrant series. I think its in Mercenary.

Those are what I can think of off the top of my head. I started reading adult Sci-fi/fantasy as a young teen; it was what my dad had on the book shelf. It was way better than my mom's hysterical romances/bodice rippers. :-P

I liked the romances as presented in Sci-Fi as the women seemed to be im more control; less whiny and pathetic that the ones in 1970s/early 1980s romances.

**michelle the librarian**

[rm.livejournal.com]

This is awesome, thank you. I think Mists of Avalon will at least get an honorable mention, because I remember being heartbroken (at 12) that the whole Guin/Lncelot/Arthur thing didn't work out better -- it was my first introduction to poly. And in the scheme of things, probably less toxic than the infamous "I love you" "I know" moment from Star Wars that infested my brain at 5.

[ladyaelfwynn.livejournal.com]

Thanks! Yeah, I really liked that G/L/A thing in MoA as well.

I tried to use just fairly well-known names in the genre.

It's cool to know that years of voracious reading are being more useful than keeping me from being bored!

Looking forward to your column!

[dipping_sauce]

Hmm, for poly, there was a functional threesome in Vonda McIntyre's Starfarers series. One woman, two guys -- I can't remember their names, though :(

[graene.livejournal.com]

She was Victoria, can't remember the males' names though. Wasn't that actually a foursome, but the fourth died right before the series started?

[realtsunamigirl.livejournal.com]

Well, if you like space opera, it's hard to ignore Aral and Cordelia Vorkosigan, from the Vorkosigan books by Lois McMaster Bujold. A love story that begins in their thirties and in their sixties shows in sign of slowing down in the slightest. Their son Miles and his love Ekatarin are also wonderfully romantic, you'll find them in Komarr, A Civil Campaign and Diplomatic Immunity.

Good stuff.

How about Jake and Zoe from the latter Callahan's Crosstime Saloon by Spider Robinson? I'm especially fond of them because Zoe is described as being a very curvy lady and Jake is salivatingly in lust with her as well as hopelessly in love.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

I just sent you a whole long list, but then I remembered:

Prince Lir & the Unicorn (The Last Unicorn, Peter S. Beagle)

You should probably expect more of these throughout the day as things come to me.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Yay. You have read ALL THE BOOKS.

And seriously would you classify Interview with the Vampire as fantasy? and not horror?

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

I would, but I find the line between horror & fantasy to be vague at best, especially in the non-gory magical-ish stuff, like vampires & werewolves & so-on. Especially when magic & spells work in the universe. I don't know what your venue will think though. However, for what it's worth, I've found Anne Rice (& Clive Barker & Poppy Z. Brite) in the SF&F section of B&N, but I don't know what that says.

[rm.livejournal.com]

*nod*. For the purposes of this I am using Barker as a horror writer who also happens to have written fantasy books, which is, i think, legitimate for placing Imajica.

But vampires, man! Hrrrr.

[virginie-m.livejournal.com]

Did you know that The Vintner's Luck is soon to be made into a feature film? I don't think it'll be out of print for long. It's being written and directed by Niki Caro, who also made Whale Rider. God I love that book!

[rm.livejournal.com]

No, I didn't! My god. My god.

[virginie-m.livejournal.com]

I KNOW! I'm sort of both scared and excited. I mean Niki Caro is a very talented woman, but the challenge of realising the book is a huge one. It would be quite easy to get it wrong I think.

[strange-selkie.livejournal.com]

Ged/Tenar in the Earthsea Books. Because that is fucked up. And then she tried to recant-by-not-recanting in Tehanu.

[aynatonal.livejournal.com]

I second the rec for The Left Hand of Darkness. If you haven't read it, I bet you'd enjoy it. It's got some really interesting and twisty gender stuff in it.

[ladyofthelog.livejournal.com]

Justin/Grant in Cyteen! *loves*

Also, I second the rec for Aral/Cordelia (Bujold) as well as Miles/Ekaterin (the second generation of Vorkosigan awesome).

Hmm. I'm sure either of our mutual friends R would have some ideas, if you'd like me to ask them.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Sure!

I always think of the Justin/Grant thing as so secondary in Cyteen.

[shayguevara.livejournal.com]

If you can count comic books...
Tristan/Isole in Camelot 3000 (by Mike Barr & Brian Bolland) when Tristan is reincarnated as a woman).

Not the best ever, but a nice twist on the classic myth.

[rufus.livejournal.com]

is time-travel enough to count as "science-fiction"? Because if so I heartily endorse anything written by Diana Gabaldon. Technically she's a romance writer, but she is really, really, really good, and her stories have vibrant characters and solid historical grounding that make them absolutely fascinating. And there are (several) love stories involved, Jaime/Claire being the main one. Mmmmmmm Highlanders. *ahem*

Also, there is George R.R. Martin and the four books in the Song of Ice and Fire series, though I can't think of any of his pairings that are exactly *happy*. Well, maybe Jon Snow/Ygritte the Wilding, or Tyrion/Shae, but neither of them last for long.

David Eddings, also, may have some stuff, though it's been so long now since I read it that I can't think of pairings.

[miep.livejournal.com]

umm, Jane Yolen's _Alta_ books (sister light/sister dark, etc.) have some interesting relationships, and some are f/f

[ladyofthelog.livejournal.com]

Oh! A book Gabriel recommended to me, which I adore, has a threesome - Black Wine, by Candas Jane Dorsey.
http://www.amazon.com/Black-Wine-Candas-Jane-Dorsey/dp/0312861818

I think I've lent my copy out (hence, no name citations - I can't remember them off the top of my head), because I can't find it anywhere. but you would definitely like it if you haven't read it already.

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Storm Constatine's Wraeththu trilogy is all about hermaphrodites who have a poly society. Even though the main couple (Calanthe and Pellaz) keep getting jealous of each other and end up preferring monogamy, there's lots of polygamy going on with other people and how they deal with expectations.

[annnimeee.livejournal.com]

peaking from _riverside. Mercedes Lackey's Bedlam Bard series with Eric has a threesome elf/human female/mage (for the life of me, I can't remember their names). And I don't know if this counts or not, but the Meredith Gentry series by Laurell K Hamilton is basically a constant orgy. Actually, her Anita Blake books are similar, although there we fall into the vampires debate where Meredith is a fairy. Not that I'm recommending these books per se, but thought if you had read them that they might nudge a memory or two.

Aaron/Darvish/Chandra from Tanya Huff's Of Darkness, Lift, & Fire [The Fire's Stone]doesn't have a 3-way romance but it does have one male in a reciprocated love with another and married to a female and all three are super good friends.

But I think an [f'ed up] pairing I really liked was Mercedes Lackey's Vanyel/Tylendel. That's a angsty-suicide-supermagic powers-reincarnation relationship.

[raaven.livejournal.com]

Gael Baudino's Gossamer Axe is a fantasy about a female harpist trying for centuries to retrieve her female lover from an evil elven sorceror.

The Fifth Millenium series by SM Stirling, Karen Wehrstein and Shirley Meier starts with a pairing of two women, and grows into some flavor of poly, IIRC.

Stephen Leigh's Dark Water's Embrace is poly-oriented, though I've not read it myself.

Mercedes Lackey's Tarma & Kethry (Oathbound) are two women who, while not physically or romantically involved, are committed to building a family together. Eventually they find a man with whom Kethry starts having babies, and they become a family triad (Tarma is completely asexual though, so it may not speak in the way you're looking for).

[raaven.livejournal.com]

Ooh, also:

http://www.lesbiansciencefiction.com/LSFCharbyAuth0001.html

and

http://www.amazon.com/Polyamorous-Science-Fiction/lm/KRI7KWY4OEJN/ref=cm_srch_res_rpli_alt/002-6466756-4052008

might be useful.