oh fandom, NO!

[rm]

http://community.livejournal.com/jackxianto/3668643.html
in which someone says something that sounds an awful lot like "die-hard SF/F fans are an oppressed minority."

http://community.livejournal.com/jackxianto/3668643.html?view=12636067#t12636067
In which I yell.

thanks for the heads-up from starstealingirl

Subcutlures, because they are by definitions not the mainstream dominant culture, are technically minorities.

But here's the deal, I'm a minority because I'm queer, because I'm Jewish, because I am not as white as look.

Engaging with enterainment in a non-culturally dominant way may be responsible for affecting the tone of huge swathes of my life, but it doesn't define it. Being a member of an actual minority does.

I am not a minority because I like SF/F or because I cried and cried and cried for Ianto or even because I have an unpopular fannish opinion in the sense that I'm not all worked up about RTD and whether he respects fandom or not -- I don't care, I don't need his approval.

Believe me, I get what you are saying. For older fen in particular, there is this very real sense of being in this small, sort of looked down upon subculture and since many of us interact with the world differently than the mainstream (there are studies on the high incidence of the non-neurotypical in the fannish community), I do sort of get why you chose this angle to frame your point.

But with things like Harry Potter, Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, Comic Con, Dragon*Con, and, yes, the Children of Earth miniseries, fannishness is now a pretty nearly mainstream activity.

But more than that: no one ever threw beer bottles at me for being fannish. No one ever threatened to rape me for being fannish. No one fucking threatened to beat my face in with a brick for being fannish. They have (the first two) because I was gay and (the third) because I'm Jewish.

Considering one of the biggest plot points and now fandom controversies relates to the show's handling of Ianto's sexuality, you really might want to check yourself here.

I am a minority and it's not because I loved a man who never was, even though I did.

Comments

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[stardragonca.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure that about 90% of the people who regularly watch the show have no idea who Russell T Davies is, and wouldn't remember five minutes after you told them.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[fide-et-spe.livejournal.com]

Yes but Spock was meant to stay dead! It was a classic example of fans getting what they want. I'm long enough in the tooth to remember. The fans even graffitied the studios with "Spock is coming back, whether they like it or not" Leonard Nimoy wasn't even keen. Anyhow here he is, still playing the role while even Shatner moved on, so that one worked out well...

I have just read some of the articles from this comic con and it does seem that the fans found RTD very rude and he really is just getting more unpopular, it does seem extraordinarily stupid of him. Also it sounds like people found Joss Whedon very sweet, and he thanked the fans a lot. I never really watched Buffy, but was reading the articles and it turns out he went out of his way to make the death of Tara "right" after the fans were devastated, even trying to get the actress to come back, but she refused. (By the way, as I said, know nothing about Joss W or his work, just read this in the After Elton article)

It may not be RTD's job, but you know what, most of us were brought up with better manners, and that's what I think he needs, simple politeness and grace, it really wouldn't kill him.

I also think he should just acknowledge these mostly young people who have their heart in the right place, raising £4000 for Children in Need is really admirable, and I don't see what harm there is in it.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[stardragonca.livejournal.com]

It is not bad mannered to tell people things that they do not want to hear. It is merely not agreeable.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[fide-et-spe.livejournal.com]

Oh I think you misunderstood, as I said, I don't care at all what he thinks about it. That wasn't my point. It is just the way he goes about it. He could be gracious and polite, there is no need to be arrogant and facetious towards fans.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[stardragonca.livejournal.com]

Gracious and polite is what people expect of servants and subordinates. People who aren't either pretty much do as they damn way please.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[fide-et-spe.livejournal.com]

Well I'm not either, and I try hard to be both. As do most of my colleagues, and those that don't are regarded as rude and ill mannered.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[ophymirage.livejournal.com]

well, that certainly clarifies why you and I were not seeing eye-to-eye earlier... I think I'll retreat to my copy of Miss Manners and thank you for an engaging and interesting discussion. :D

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[ophymirage.livejournal.com]

The average viewing public? sure. but how many of those are the ones who buy the DVDs, the novel tie-ins, the audio play downloads, the action figures? who pay BIG money to go to cons, to buy facetime with JB and GDL and DT and etc.?

Ratings numbers are one thing. Money spent on your product is another.

To simplify with a CEO analogy:

Mac fans are rabid about Apple products, and tend to be both intelligent and highly opinionated (and proselytize about their product like ANYTHING.) They also tend to be fairly well off, and love congregating at cons like MacWorld. At MacWorld, the biggest event is Steve Jobs' keynote address to premiere new product.

Steve Jobs goes to MacWorld, stands up to give his address, and opens with "You guys are all morons and I have no interest in what you have to say about my product. Moreover, you have no right to tell me about how I should make that product work."

Now, that may be 100% true. However, I don't think it's an attitude likely to keep Apple in business, or keep its most ardent advocates happy, and Jobs' Board of Directors might encourage him to not speak next year.

Re: PR-wise or marketing-wise

[stardragonca.livejournal.com]

but how many of those are the ones who buy the DVDs, the novel tie-ins, the audio play downloads, the action figures?
Almost all of them, I should think.

who pay BIG money to go to cons, to buy facetime with JB and GDL and DT and etc.?
This 2nd group is insignificant compared to the first group.
And even if they weren't, there's no reason why they shouldn't be told that they don't get a vote. Because they don't.