red state letters - 1
Nov. 4th, 2004 06:40 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rmWhen I was just starting university, I served on the March of Dimes National Youth Council with approximately a dozen and a half other young community service leaders age 17 to 25. One of the girls was from Tennessee, and in the course of some conversation or other during a meeting, she mentioned that she went to church three or four times a week.
I spluttered and asked her why and then noted that I'd never been to church really other than for particular events like weddings, or on trips to see historic ones, or occassionally on a whim.
She looked at me, deeply puzzled at said. "Well, to socialize. I mean, what all do you do in New York?" She honestly didn't know.
"Well, we spend time with our friends."
"Where?" she asked, and I found I could not tell her in a way that made sense. In our homes, in cafes, bars sometimes, I guess.
"But, how do you get to know people, how do you meet anyone?"
"New York," I said, "is very crowded."
I was thinking about her today, because I've been thinking about the red states, and the people that voted there on the so-called moral issues, and as all of us here who fancy we have morals (or ethics) do, I've been trying to get a handle on what is really a profound cultural difference, that truly, I can't approach, I can't get on an organic level, and it's not because I wasn't raised well.
My father, as most of you know, is a very religious if somewhat eccentric man who has explored a lot of religions in his life. And while he doesn't go to church every, or really even any Sunday, the fact is he spends most of his time on his religious writing, and is deeply interested in listening to God.
My father and I don't agree on everything when it comes to morals, ethics or politics, and I dislike the intimacy of discussing religion with him -- I've my beliefs, and he has his, and it's well enough. But there are some things I know about God and the way lots of people view God because he's my dad and because we read a lot of psalms at the dinner table on Thanksgiving. All of which leaves me with some things to say to people voting on moral/religious issues in the so-called "red states".
Your God is a great and powerful God. He has put things awesome in their scale and perfect in their detail into being and has set into motion a world more complex than you or I can understand. This isn't me trying to talk to you in language you'll understand, and this isn't me being condescending, this is just what I've been told, what I've been given to understand about God. He's certainly impressive.
And he woos people to his cause, to his belief, constantly. If he did not religion would not be the force it is in this country, and Christianity in its myriad forms would not have swept the world as it has.
Your God is ubiquitous, convincing, compelling and appealing and he wins over new followers every day.
Which means your God is a lot more powerful than politics. A lot more convincing. A lot more healing.
Which leads me to wonder why it is you think that politics is the best means (or even a remotely desireable or acceptable avenue) to get people to live the way you believe God wishes people to live. Because as someone in a blue state, at someone in New York City, I hear this combination of politics and faith and I get angry and resentful, and I stop listening. Outlawing the things you think are sins will never stop a sin, and because the human race is often weak and petulant in many ways and so this only encourages sin.
I guess my point is, I don't actually have a problem with your beliefs -- I live where I do so I can live the way I want, and I suppose you live where you do for the same reasons. And I don't have a problem with you trying to sway me to your beliefs. But I do have a problem with you doing it through politics. I think it's ineffective. I think it harms your mission, and I think it does anything but bring glory to your God and your faith. In fact I think it reeks of hubris and is disrespectful to your beliefs, to your God and to His creations. It really offends me -- not because it conflicts with how I live, but because some things in this world deserve more respect than you're giving them. Certainly, I would never treat my equivalent of your God the same way.
Anyway, as much as I don't always get where either you red state folks or my dad are coming from when it comes to God, I do wish you red state folks would be more like my dad, and listen to God over preachers and politicians. I don't think you'd hear a different set of rules, but I am deeply convinced you'd hear a different set of tactics, one that I think could only benefit all of us, despite our different goals and ways of being.
Certainly, in the end, it would all shake out a lot more interesting. Shouldn't I choose God, as opposed to being compelled to him?
Flies and honey. Be gentler, I think. Be gentler.
I spluttered and asked her why and then noted that I'd never been to church really other than for particular events like weddings, or on trips to see historic ones, or occassionally on a whim.
She looked at me, deeply puzzled at said. "Well, to socialize. I mean, what all do you do in New York?" She honestly didn't know.
"Well, we spend time with our friends."
"Where?" she asked, and I found I could not tell her in a way that made sense. In our homes, in cafes, bars sometimes, I guess.
"But, how do you get to know people, how do you meet anyone?"
"New York," I said, "is very crowded."
I was thinking about her today, because I've been thinking about the red states, and the people that voted there on the so-called moral issues, and as all of us here who fancy we have morals (or ethics) do, I've been trying to get a handle on what is really a profound cultural difference, that truly, I can't approach, I can't get on an organic level, and it's not because I wasn't raised well.
My father, as most of you know, is a very religious if somewhat eccentric man who has explored a lot of religions in his life. And while he doesn't go to church every, or really even any Sunday, the fact is he spends most of his time on his religious writing, and is deeply interested in listening to God.
My father and I don't agree on everything when it comes to morals, ethics or politics, and I dislike the intimacy of discussing religion with him -- I've my beliefs, and he has his, and it's well enough. But there are some things I know about God and the way lots of people view God because he's my dad and because we read a lot of psalms at the dinner table on Thanksgiving. All of which leaves me with some things to say to people voting on moral/religious issues in the so-called "red states".
Your God is a great and powerful God. He has put things awesome in their scale and perfect in their detail into being and has set into motion a world more complex than you or I can understand. This isn't me trying to talk to you in language you'll understand, and this isn't me being condescending, this is just what I've been told, what I've been given to understand about God. He's certainly impressive.
And he woos people to his cause, to his belief, constantly. If he did not religion would not be the force it is in this country, and Christianity in its myriad forms would not have swept the world as it has.
Your God is ubiquitous, convincing, compelling and appealing and he wins over new followers every day.
Which means your God is a lot more powerful than politics. A lot more convincing. A lot more healing.
Which leads me to wonder why it is you think that politics is the best means (or even a remotely desireable or acceptable avenue) to get people to live the way you believe God wishes people to live. Because as someone in a blue state, at someone in New York City, I hear this combination of politics and faith and I get angry and resentful, and I stop listening. Outlawing the things you think are sins will never stop a sin, and because the human race is often weak and petulant in many ways and so this only encourages sin.
I guess my point is, I don't actually have a problem with your beliefs -- I live where I do so I can live the way I want, and I suppose you live where you do for the same reasons. And I don't have a problem with you trying to sway me to your beliefs. But I do have a problem with you doing it through politics. I think it's ineffective. I think it harms your mission, and I think it does anything but bring glory to your God and your faith. In fact I think it reeks of hubris and is disrespectful to your beliefs, to your God and to His creations. It really offends me -- not because it conflicts with how I live, but because some things in this world deserve more respect than you're giving them. Certainly, I would never treat my equivalent of your God the same way.
Anyway, as much as I don't always get where either you red state folks or my dad are coming from when it comes to God, I do wish you red state folks would be more like my dad, and listen to God over preachers and politicians. I don't think you'd hear a different set of rules, but I am deeply convinced you'd hear a different set of tactics, one that I think could only benefit all of us, despite our different goals and ways of being.
Certainly, in the end, it would all shake out a lot more interesting. Shouldn't I choose God, as opposed to being compelled to him?
Flies and honey. Be gentler, I think. Be gentler.
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no subject
Date: 2004-11-04 04:30 pm (UTC)I enjoyed reading your post - very well written. I'll share this with you, I was raised in the church and mostly at my own insistence. My parents weren't particularly religious but believed the children should be raised in the church. So every Sunday we were carted off to Sunday school. When I reached the 6th grade I had a huge interest in the church and switched from my parents church (I never saw my parents in church - ever) to what I wanted to check out.
I've always been independent and sought my own answers. That doesn't always rub the right way with my family (who are now extremely religious - and I know they all voted for Bush). I mostly leave them alone and do my own thing.
When you mentioned your co-worker from Tennessee and her comments, it struck a cord with me. I lived in Tennessee when I was a teen and attended church (again at my own insistence) anywhere from 4 to five times a week. It was not only social but religious.
As a young adult, I continued my quest on my own and attended independent churches. Often attending anywhere from 1 to 3 times a week. When I turned 26 I had a religious revelation (again, just me) and couldn't get enough of seeking out God (or a higher power). I found a church that had services 7 days a week (depended on the part of the year, the church had a tent up during the spring and summer months). I often attended anywhere from 5-7 times a week. This kept up for 4-5 years. I then stopped going completely and searched on my own - with no church influence at all and attended no church at all. That's pretty much where I am today - I don't attend church, but I do my own quiet seeking.
TMI?
I also have a life-long friend in Tennessee (her parents and my grandparents were neighbors, so I've known her since the day I was born). She just sent this e-mail to me:
"I am so glad the election is over and that Bush won! Looks like the christians got out and voted. Kerry and his wife are scarry. I think she must be a drunk. Did you vote? I voted last week. Tn had early voting and that made it easier than standing in line.
. . .
Sorry, I didn't read the read of your e-mail before I sent one back to you. You have to put your voting ballots in a box? We have electronic machines and do not have any ballot boxes. I don't understand why the states are different. Looks like we would all have the same machines. At least Florida wasn't a problem this time and it wasn't so close. You have to know who I was for. I am definitely not for abortion and it kills me to think about it. I just think Mrs. Heinz-Kerry just looks like a drunk. I am so thankful that the christian people voted for a chrisitian and also that the ban on same sex marriage was shot down. That says a lot about Americans I think. I am just so glad it is over!
Have a great day!"
It saddens me that religion has seemingly become the driving force when electing the president. I am also shocked at the tone of my best friends e-mail. I'm still formulating what to write back to her.
Oh well, enough of my life story.
Thank you for such lovely posts!
Susan