has everyone gone insane?

[rm]

Olbermann vs. Hannity reaches new levels of batshittery:

http://www.wowowow.com/politics/olbermann-pony-big-money-every-second-hannity-waterboarded-video-276465

via nancylebov

Comments

[ferriludant.livejournal.com]

I don't see this as gender essentialistic masculinity competition (okay, caveat: I'm a man)....

I see it as essentially a confrontation between voices of two conflicting movements: On one hand, the educated, compassionate, passionate truthteller faction, and on the other, the "fuck the weak, I've got mine, jack - and who are you going to believe: me, or your lying eyes" faction.

Yeah, I'm in Olbermann's camp on this and on so much more.

[rm.livejournal.com]

It's the style of argumentation (which I fully admit to enjoying from Olbermann) that concerns me, but then I spend an inordinate time being a female person in an activity related to the honour of men of a certain class. And while even one of my fencing masters is female, I can't forget that not only would I not have the right to such arms in the times the work I study was actively used, I would not have even been considered to have a soul.

I use phrases like "man up" all the time and I try to weasel it and say that I can or that it's different or whatever, because sometimes I'm dressing/presenting as a man. But I do, in truth, intellectually believe that sort of discourse is toxic and enforcing of harmful norms and expectations on all genders.

I've heard Olbermann tell people to "be a man" on the program. I have cheered it in the moment and I have agreed with it in concept. But it's a language use I dislike, especially from someone so viciously articulate, and that particular tonal quality particularly tends to infuse the MSNBC vs. Fox drama, and I wish it wouldn't. It doesn't need to.

[ferriludant.livejournal.com]

Okay, completely granted: "be a man", and "man up" are *obviously* gender-normative phrases, and toxic in many ways.

But I didn't catch those phrases in the video. Perhaps I missed it. What I did see was Olbermann calling Hannity on a particularly egregious instance of crass, brutish, pseudo-populism, relating to a hugely important issue.

Incidentally, I wouldn't have been allowed to carry a sword in that period either, because my birth doesn't place me in the right class. There were *lots* of things which sucked back then.

But the swords were cool. :)

[rm.livejournal.com]

Nope, hasn't happened on this topic yet. Has happened between Olbermann and Hannity (and other MSNBC people) on other topics. I really, really don't want to see it here.

And yup on the swords. I wrote you this long comment and then was like "oh god, this is either boring or he already knows this" and deleted half of it.

[ferriludant.livejournal.com]

Heh. I deleted nearly twice what I ended up posting, too. For different reasons, I expect, but a thoughtful exchange is worthwhile, neh?