the questions of our times: formality and vampires

[rm]

This, thanks to a discussion started by weirdquark. Please do visit the comments where you will learn many things including the many ways formality is structured in different languages (something my questions did not fully take into account, and I apologize for that), werewolf pack dynamics considerations, and whether there are vampires in France.

[Poll #1601631]

Comments

[spiderine.livejournal.com]

With werewolves, definitely use the informal. They're *dogs*. Don't show fear or submission, show dominance!

[heartofoshun.livejournal.com]

I like this one!

[torenheksje.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure I wouldn't stop to have actual conversations with any supernatural beasties. I'd be too busy running in the opposite direction.

[torenheksje.livejournal.com]

P.S. Only YOU would have a poll like this.

[shadowvalkyrie.livejournal.com]

My inner language geek adores this poll. Seriously, it's brilliant.

[tenacious-snail.livejournal.com]

FTW.

[hab318princess.livejournal.com]

I've tried to approach this from a background with a language with formal word forms - was actually surprised that the grammar aspect did not come into it as I first thought

[sykii.livejournal.com]

You don't want to use the formal with a kobold. If it understands you at all, it will just think you're putting on airs.

[msp-hacker.livejournal.com]

I would use the answer I used for vampires, with the exception of fairies. Unless they actually say "Call me Bob!" I am using formal grammar because fairies fuck your shit up. For fun.

[filkerdave.livejournal.com]

Presumably, in the case of fairies, it would be "Yes Sir, Mr. Bob!" (Or "Yes, ma'am, Ms. Bob," depending on the fairy)

[ladyaelfwynn.livejournal.com]

It depends on the supernatural creature, their age, and cognitive ability. Zombies informal, Nosreatu formal. Weres - very confusing. Age and ability to eat you factors highly. Ghost kids, informal, Nearly Headless Nick, formal. Someone really ought to write a book. ;-p

[pantryslut.livejournal.com]

don't tempt.

[sethg]

For some reason, the sentence “we all live at fangspoint” is now running through my head.

[bugeyedmonster.livejournal.com]

lol

[hoyland54.livejournal.com]

Vampires and ghosts have the added wrinkle that their age is fixed. Is an old child vampire a child or are they older than you? Though I suppose the maturity level of vampires is fixed along with their age, so perhaps they're clearly children.

[bugeyedmonster.livejournal.com]

Or perhaps their mind matures while their body remains stuck at time of death? In which case, address a cute six year old child vampire as a cute little child might get your face ripped off by fangs.

[sevendayloan.livejournal.com]

I try to be polite to anything that might eat me. Like vampires. Or bears.

[brewsternorth.livejournal.com]

Heh, a little like the lyrics to "Never Smile at a Crocodile".

[xtricks.livejournal.com]

Hrm. I wouldn't use formal or informal; I'd shoot 'em in the face. Or, well, stake 'em in the heart. Or decapitate! Decapitate works on everyone(almost)!

[katrinb.livejournal.com]

There is absolutely no reason that you cannot show proper courtesy to someone whilst decapitating them.
It's a matter of self-respect.

[juliansinger.livejournal.com]

Werewolf: Nope.

Elf: Yep.

Faerie: Depends on the type of fairy, but generally, yes. Courtesy's fairly vital.

Ghost: Depends on the ghost.

Zombie: Goodness no.

[archmage-brian.livejournal.com]

It all depends on how they want to be addressed, and some things may not be apparent at a glance. For example, do they have a vampire doctorate?

[silmaril.livejournal.com]

Native language Turkish; definitely has the formal/informal distinction. In the vampire case, age first and then degree of acquaintance would determine the usage, and to start with it would be formal by default. In the ghost case, likewise. Werewolves aren't necessarily that much older than me, I assume, so degree of acquaintance would make the decision.

[rarelylynne.livejournal.com]

I would go with whatever the rules of the language being spoken are. It's situational, but assuming that I'm not already intimate friends with said vampire, a bit of formality to begin with is generally considered polite both in English and French, until one is given leave to speak informally.

I make no claims to knowledge for either other languages or other life forms, other than to note that courtesy with Faerie is important, but if the rules in Rosemary and Rue hold true, you should never say thank you because it creates an obligation you don't want with the faerie in question.

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

For #2 I didn't answer 'cause I mostly decided based on "If I were a vampire, how would I want people to decide?"

I think maybe it depends on the genre of vampire, too. Like, True Blood vampires are different from Twilight vampires are different from classical literature vampires, etc.

[shadowvalkyrie.livejournal.com]

True! Hm... I'd say for most vampires the simple formal would suffice, but since Dracula is a count, I'd probably use the majestic plural. (I'm not sure, but I think the German dubs do this, which would explain where I got the notion from.)

[kittydesade.livejournal.com]

I note that your poll does not consider language shift through the centuries considering most of these creatures have the potential to live through several shifts of language. Or Japanese, which has varying strata of politeness.

Although now I am curious to know what level of politeness you're supposed to address various creatures with in Japanese. Would you use the -masu form or the -tegozaimasu type uber-polite form.

Anyway! You got me thinking. :P

Although while I'm at it, there is language protocol to ask, politely, what level of formality you're supposed to speak to a person at in Russian, so there might be for other languages too, although I don't know of it in either Spanish or French.

[rm.livejournal.com]

The multiple levels of formality thing is new to me (since I know about three sentences of Japanese all of which basically translate to "oh fuck, I'm at Pennsic sweating my ass off, would you like a rice ball?") and raise some great questions. Many others in comments have addressed that phenomena as well.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

Totally depends.

If I'm a fangbanger and the vamp is my steady sweetie, informal all the way.
If it's a vampire I don't know, completely formal, with Sir and Ma'am thrown in for good measure.

Werewolves...depends. If he's my lit prof, then he's still Dr. Camomescro, whether or not he gets furry once a month. If he's one of my kids' friends, then "Hey, puppy" or "Yo, dawg" is fine.

Ghosts, no need. They're psychic energy projections of past events stored in a location and replayed when someone of proper mind type is around. They aren't actual beings.

Zombies, real: formal. These are priests who have undergone a transformative death & resurrection experience. They deserve the formal. Zombies, traditional folkloric: informal. I own them and they work for me. Walking dead brain-eaters, I let my shotgun speak for me.

The Good People? As formally as I can manage with any Gaelic I know.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Best (and most appreciated) zombie answer to date.

[trinker.livejournal.com]

Japanese native speaker -

Avoid use of pronouns. Default to the stranger-polite level.

Why are you talking to the vamp/etc anyway? Roles in play trump any other consideration.

[crazysoph.livejournal.com]

Hello Trinker!

Just riffing on the Japanese (for the others reading, I'm merely studying it, and not doing very well at that...) to vampires - stranger-polite but without too much humble/honorific? (or, honorific but avoiding humble, unless the speaker was placing him/herself explicitly in a servile position to the vampire? Would that be a one-way trip, or could that be adapted - used in a moment to diffuse tension, dropped when the general situation was more relaxed...)

Thanks for letting me put this bug in your ear! :)

Crazy(and probably going to be thinking about this question now as I drift off to sleep...)Soph

[kessie.livejournal.com]

If the werewolf wasn't the "I'm going to stare you down and then scare the crap out of you" type, I would try formal language and showing smarts.

If they were more in touch with their animal side (haha), I'd try not to show weakness while wanting to run away as fast as possible.

[idiomagic.livejournal.com]

This is pretty straightforward for me, as I'm a Southern girl.

When in doubt of another person's age or station, always err on the side of formality. Substitute "creature", I suppose, for "person".

Of course, if I were tending bar or waiting tables at the time I encountered said creature, it would be very different. There would be no actual introduction, so I would fall back on the Southern default of calling them "Sugar" or "Honey" or "Boo". The latter, of course, I would omit when addressing a ghost.

[laufeyette.livejournal.com]

The latter, of course, I would omit when addressing a ghost.

LMAO! +1000000.

[missysedai.livejournal.com]

I ALWAYS err to the side of formality, though if I know the vampire fairly well, I assume s/he would have already given me leave to say Du.

In the case of the ancient vampires, say, like my German Composition teacher at the Gymnasium was (OK, she probably wasn't really a vampire, but she could have passed for one, and she was REALLY ANCIENT), formal all the way, even if leave to say Du has been granted, because sometimes they ask you to say Du just to be nice, even though it makes their teeth itch. Older folks like to be shown proper respect, and I'd prefer not to make a vampire's teeth itch in any case, lest I be the one s/he decides to scratch the itch with.

[verasteine.livejournal.com]

Only you would have a poll about how to address a vampire. You know, formality and shit. And then I'm sitting behind my PC going... hmm, would I use formal or informal? Well, that'd depend on how rude they were, and whether they'd want to eat me, wouldn't it? :D

[brilliant-snark.livejournal.com]

Interrupting to express icon love. :)

[nysidra.livejournal.com]

My studies in foreign language have taught me to err on the side of formality. I'd stick to that and wait to be corrected.

[filkerdave.livejournal.com]

BTW, do you mind if I point other people to this entry?

[rm.livejournal.com]

Go for it.